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Topic:
Does the AE AB Debuff work???
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Rituals
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Posts:
138
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
11/14/05 9:02pm
Subject:
Does the AE AB Debuff work???
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I have heard that the AE AB debuff in the creep line is not very effective. Was wondering if there are any creep spec Animists out there that like thier spec and do they find speccing in creep is effective in RVR.
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Momolicious
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Posts:
1,886
Registered:
Jan '02
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Date Posted:
11/15/05 1:43pm
Subject:
RE: Does the AE AB Debuff work???
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Well I have only been able to actively see the differance in 2 long fights so far.
49 SM/44 Pierce 50 Vamp VS. 50 Flex Reaver.
My wife is the Vamp.
We popped in the backdoor of DDB right after outer doors fell. Reaver rounds the corner, I ABS debuff. Cleric an Wiz round the other corner. Ae Root them. Wiz can see me but not Vamp, I hide.
Cleric was healing the Reaver with AE or Spread heals.
All in all we lost.
BUT.
A lookover of the fights damages.
Wife got in 1 390ish shot. The rest seemed to be normal ordinary damage vs Chain.
The second example was same Vamp an I. Vs Skald +.
I had wispd the Skald first and Con Debuffed before the ABS landed and I was mzd. I am not certain if ABS is Body based, or if the con debuff is relivant.
Short end of the fight is the same as the Reaver fight. 1 Semi high hit the rest seemed the same.
The way Absorption is explained, in the tutorial at least. Is that all damage is calculated via skill, dps, style bonus - ABS.
If history has shown us anything about Mythics math skills and Debuffs. I think this is what happens.
Bare damage of 1000 (Big easy number).
1000 - 27% absorption = 730
730 - resist/bonus to damage type [-10%]. = 657(-73)
Now add ABS debuff as I think it is now.
1000 - 22.95%(27-15%) = 771
771 - 10% = 694(-77)
This though is how it SHOULD be working. (Yet obviously is NOT)
1000 - 12% (27 - 15) = 880
880 - 10% = 792(-88)
This though is all conjecture on my part, and quite possibly bad math too. I am sure someone will correct me here.
The long winding answer though is. On Mobs it seems to work well enough. On players it is not worth the mana. I personally have the sneaking suspicion it will work better against an ABS buffed player (Heritic, All cloth casters with ABS buff up, Barrier of Fortitude and Soldiers barricade.) Possibly suffering the 50% split on all debuffs vs 'buffed' and unbuffed.
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Momolicious -- 50(Tristan)/50(Gareth) Luri Champ
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Rena_Lanford
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Title: Mythic Team Lead
Animist TL
Posts:
16,169
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
11/15/05 9:21pm
Subject:
RE: Does the AE AB Debuff work???
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"On Mobs it seems to work well enough. On players it is not worth the mana. "
Thats it in a nutshell.
Player and Mobs abs are calculated differently. On high end mobs (where you would actually try to debuff their abs) they tend to have Absorb in the 90-95% range (Levi, Krakken, Talos, Draco, other various encounter/ML mobs)
Debuffing them by 20% there *almost* drops them 20 points in abs.
Compare that to a player, where the median Abs is 18% and even then, the average is probably closer to 0 (significantly more cloth than heavy armor).
No matter what value you debuff for of them, you are looking at a debuff of 5% at best, compare that with a 19 spec which would debuff by 3% at best.
BTW, in case you still arent seeing it, a 'high variance' lifetap would still typically hit for 20% per cast (on a decent resist target). That would mean it requires 5 tanks to hit a target AFTER the abs debuff hits for them to beat you tapping. Figure the Abs debuff takes about 4-5 seconds to travel, which would be 3 taps (yes, the wisp debuff DD bomber will outhit the tap, but im using the worst DPS example for a reason) and you probably, ignoring the tap damage, have a dead target already.
5 tanks, 5 seconds = 3-4 rounds of combat each, or 15-20 attacks.
Even if the target isnt dead, is it worth the debuff at this point?
Newp. Necro Debuff will increase a tank trains damage by about 50-80%, it has no travel time and is useful. While the Abs debuff *IS* AE, 5% is far from as effective as 50-80% (80% being its effectiveness on support, which is where you WANT to debuff stuff).
In order for the debuff to be effective w/o revamping the spell, they need to have it strip off the amount listed, not use the delve amount as a % of the Abs. Dropping targets down to 0 Abs as a high end creeper provides a DPS lacking spec a niche in a group. Split spec Anis dropping Abs by 10 again, gives them reason to use it in a fight over just nuking.
I know this, other anis know this and I really dont know why it just hasnt been changed yet. Would be spiff to see some Ani/Eld/Druid/Druid/Bard/3 tank groups out there hehe.
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