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Topic:
Anyone Using Damage Debuff Shrooms?
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BanzaiBard
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Posts:
2,133
Registered:
Jul '03
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Date Posted:
1/17/05 10:57am
Subject:
Anyone Using Damage Debuff Shrooms?
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Questions:
1. Do they work in RvR?
2. Does the PBAE and the ranged stack?
3. What exactly does the % debuff mean? If I would have taken 100 pts a 9% debuff makes me take only 91?
Do you find these tools useful in PvE?
What level are the spells for spell resistance?
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Ceribis
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Posts:
917
Registered:
Jul '03
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Date Posted:
1/17/05 11:45am
Subject:
RE: Anyone Using Damage Debuff Shrooms?
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1. Do they work in RvR?
As far as I know they should work in RvR.
2. Does the PBAE and the ranged stack?
Again, from what I know they do not. Just two different ways of giving the debuff. The higher level one might overwrite the lower level one, but you'd have to ask a Creeper about this.
3. What exactly does the % debuff mean? If I would have taken 100 pts a 9% debuff makes me take only 91?
From what I've heard it reduced melee damage by the delve %. However, resists problem decreases that value and duration, and I heard it doesn't work well with Style Damage. I don't even thing they are worth using unless you go into higher spec creeping, or the damage reduction won't be all the noticeable.
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Keeghan BallanLosgainn ~Sylvan Emerald Ridere Animist ------------------------------------------- Keeg UI 2 coming out for 1.91! Keeg UI 2 Classic Icons Available! http://keegui.ceribis.com
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Rena_Lanford
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Title: Mythic Team Lead
Animist TL
Posts:
16,169
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
1/17/05 4:06pm
Subject:
RE: Anyone Using Damage Debuff Shrooms?
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"1. Do they work in RvR? "
- Yes
"2. Does the PBAE and the ranged stack? "
- No, the Highest Value debuff overwrites -- this will typically be the ranged. In my experiance though, the Ranged tends to spend most of the fight hitting the same healers and casters over and over (thus doing nothing meaningful) -- at least the PBAE you can have people run to.
"3. What exactly does the % debuff mean? If I would have taken 100 pts a 9% debuff makes me take only 91? "
- No, lets use 10%, its a nicer number for example. A 10% DPS debuff on a melee will lower their clamped DPS by 10%, assuming they are RR5+, their DPS will be 16.5, the DPS will have all their damage calculations be treated as if they were using a 14.9 weapon at this point. So its not exactly a flat 10% reduction in 'real DPS' its a reduction in raw, pre-style damage.
To illustrate further, lets have that weapon be a 3.0 delay weapon
Without debuff = 49.5 damage per swing
With debuff = 44.7 damage per swing
typical variance medium on a TOA'd out melee is approximately 2.75 -- the absolute cap is 3.0
using a 2.75-3.0 spread
Without debuff = 136 - 148
With debuff = 123 - 134
so, unstyled you are looking at a difference in 12-14 damage per swing (which well, is 10%)
Styled damage is based off of their base damage (which is what I calculated) -- if they style for 100% damage (there are a few styles like this, not many but I want easy numbers)
Without Debuff + style = 272 - 296
With Debuff + style = 246 - 268
difference is 26 - 28 damage, which is slightly under 10%
If the target crits, again, the number is reduced even further.
I don't have any conditions where I can run tests to see if the damage reduction is applied to the doer or the reciever, if its the receiver, there is a good chance you can hit hard enough where you will exceed the cap by enough damage that when the reduction kicks in, you still get hit for cap. This particular case would need pendragon to have all 3 hib str relics, or my own server to have them (neither does) - if thats the case, the debuffs are going to be useless against stuff like banespike'rs and relic realms (its a possibility, so I am putting it out there in case someone observed it)
BTW, the Abs debuffs work in a similar manner, assuming a 10% debuff.
Reinforced goes from being 19% Abs to 17.1 Abs ... Cloth goes from 0 abs to 0 abs .. leather goes from 10 abs to 9% abs...
as you can see, as with the DPS debuffers its all a matter of what it lands on as to the 'usefulness' and even then, its usefulness is questionable. These two spells and their RvR performance is something I personally have a problem with - they work fine in PvE, but thats a good deal of the Creeping specline thats arguably worthless in RvR. Especially with the power costs and uncontrolability of the spells/turrets.
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Hibernia
~ Devon ~
A gourmet, a hobby, money. I will enjoy a second life fully.
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MerryMadrigal
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Title: The Wonder from Down Under
Posts:
3,195
Registered:
Dec '01
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Date Posted:
1/17/05 8:01pm
Subject:
RE: Anyone Using Damage Debuff Shrooms?
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Good explanation Rena.
The abs debuff is fantastic in pve (where a mob with 60% abs might be dropped to 54%), but almost worthless in rvr (a 10% abs drop to 9% is almost unnoticeable).
There is no doubt that the Post-TOA animist "balance" nerf significantly hurt Creeping anis by far the hardest.
But not only has Mythic not addressed it, they haven't even acknowledged it.
I don't even know why I still play Creeping. Sheer orneriness I guess.
I am keeping my free respec handy though.
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Rena_Lanford
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Title: Mythic Team Lead
Animist TL
Posts:
16,169
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
1/17/05 8:35pm
Subject:
RE: Anyone Using Damage Debuff Shrooms?
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I was actually split spec Creep/Arb pre-TOA, it was too hard to keep that spec with the NF changes and the whole loss of emain 
I have a 50 creep ani that I love in PvE, she's just not as effective by a longshot compared to WM in his full arb state
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Hibernia
~ Devon ~
A gourmet, a hobby, money. I will enjoy a second life fully.
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